AILSA CHANG, HOST:
OK, we turn now to news out of the FBI. President Trump has named right-wing podcast host Dan Bongino as the FBI's deputy director. That means Bongino will be the No. 2 official at the Bureau behind the recently confirmed director, Trump loyalist Kash Patel. NPR justice correspondent Ryan Lucas is covering the story and joins us now. Hi, Ryan.
RYAN LUCAS, BYLINE: Hi there.
CHANG: OK, let's start with who Dan Bongino is exactly. Like, he's a big name in conservative media. But beyond his podcast, tell us more about him.
LUCAS: So, first off, President Trump announced this pick in a post on social media calling it great news for law enforcement and for American justice. Now, as for Bongino, he worked as a cop in New York City for a few years in the late 1990s, and then as a secret service agent for more than a decade, in fact, in the 2000s, working on presidential protective details, for example, during the George W. Bush administration. But he's best known for what he's done since leaving law enforcement, because over the past decade, really, he's become a very well-known right-wing pundit. He hosted a Fox News program for a few years. But his podcast, "The Dan Bongino Show," is now one of the most popular podcasts in the country, and he's used it to push baseless claims about the 2020 election being stolen, about the FBI itself. Bongino was banned from YouTube for pushing COVID-19 misinformation. He's also a fierce political partisan. And to give you an example of that, here he is speaking in 2018.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)
DAN BONGINO: We win, you lose. The new rules are in effect. My life is all about owning the libs now.
CHANG: OK. Well, now he's been tapped as the deputy director of the FBI. Is it unusual, Ryan, to have someone like him in that particular job?
LUCAS: It's basically unheard of to have someone like Bongino for this role. Traditionally, a senior FBI agent serves as the deputy director. And that makes a lot of sense, because they would have experience in the Bureau, know the ins and outs of the organization. Remember, there are around 38,000 people who work there. The Bureau has massive responsibilities. We're talking things like counterterrorism, violent crime, national security. And the deputy director, in essence, runs the day-to-day operations of the FBI. Now, the FBI Agents Association actually sent its members a message yesterday that the new director, Kash Patel, had told them back in January that the deputy director should be an active special agent. But after Bongino was announced as the deputy, Patel raved about it in a post on X, called Bongino an ideal choice. So the situation now is the director and the deputy director are two close allies of Trump. Two men who have a long history of making very partisan political statements. They have no senior law enforcement experience. And these are the two gentlemen now running the FBI.
CHANG: And this is all on top of the turmoil that's been happening at the FBI in recent weeks, right? Like, how do these leadership changes play into that, you think?
LUCAS: Well, you're right. It's definitely a turbulent time at the Bureau. The Trump Justice Department forced out at least eight senior FBI officials, folks who would've been providing guidance to the new director. That shakeup was followed by the Justice Department demanding and receiving the names of all FBI personnel who worked Capitol riot cases. That touched off fears about possible mass firings. Here's Chris O'Leary. He's a former senior FBI official who retired in the last few years.
CHRIS O'LEARY: I would absolutely say the appointment of Dan Bongino has pushed things over the edge, and there is a crisis at the FBI. People are concerned that we are seeing the intentional dismantlement of the FBI.
LUCAS: Now, I've heard similar concerns from other current and former FBI officials. Patel, for his part, has talked about ending what he claims is a politicization of the FBI. But one former senior FBI official told me that putting Bongino in as deputy instead of a career agent is the definition of politicizing the Bureau.
CHANG: OK, well, then what does all of this mean for the FBI's work?
LUCAS: Well, that's a big question. What impact it will have on the work, on the priorities? Patel has said he wants to get back to the basics of fighting crime. But there are a lot of concerns that this new leadership could use the vast powers of the FBI to go after Trump's perceived enemies as Trump himself has talked about.
CHANG: That is NPR's Ryan Lucas. Thank you so much, Ryan.
LUCAS: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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