A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
Tomorrow, if you're lucky, you'll find yourself in front of a large slice of Thanksgiving puh-cahn (ph) pie. Or as some people like to say it, pee-can (ph) pie. The hosts of NPR's podcast, How To Do Everything - Mike Danforth and Ian Chillag - recently dove into the puh-cahn versus pee-can debate. Mike and Ian join us now and hopefully they're going to tell us how to finally settle this, right, Mike?
MIKE DANFORTH, BYLINE: Yeah. We'll do it.
IAN CHILLAG, BYLINE: Yeah. Hey, before we get into, what do you say? Do you say pee-can or puh-cahn?
MARTÍNEZ: OK. So I used to say it one way, only because of this movie clip.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "WHEN HARRY MET SALLY")
BILLY CRYSTAL: (As Harry Burns) I have decided that for the rest of the day, we are going to talk like this.
MEG RYAN: (As Sally Albright) Like this?
CRYSTAL: (As Harry Burns) No. Please, to repeat after me. I'd be proud to partake of your pee-can pie.
RYAN: (As Sally Albright) Pee-can pie.
CRYSTAL: (As Harry Burns) Pee-can pie.
RYAN: (As Sally Albright) Pee-can pie.
CRYSTAL: (As Harry Burns) Pee-can pie.
RYAN: (As Sally Albright) Pee-can pie (laughter).
MARTÍNEZ: So, that's Billy Crystal, Meg Ryan in the great film, "When Harry Met Sally." So I used to say pee-can because that's how Billy Crystal used to say it. Then, guys, I met my wife from West Texas, who said puh-cahn, and she's, like, what are you saying? Like, you sound dumb. So, I really don't know what to say.
DANFORTH: OK. Well, so each week on our show, listeners submit questions to us and we find overqualified guests to answer them.
CHILLAG: We are going to help you decide between Billy Crystal and your wife.
DANFORTH: So we went to the perfect ultimate authority on pee-cahn (ph) pie and all things proper and good, Martha Stewart.
MARTHA STEWART: Puh-cahn.
DANFORTH: Puh-cahn.
STEWART: Puh-cahn. It's not pee-can. I don't say pee-can.
CHILLAG: If someone does say pee-can, do you correct them, or do you just accept?
STEWART: Absolutely not. But my granddaughter does.
DANFORTH: Oh. (Laughter) How does she - how does she correct them?
STEWART: (Laughter) Puh-cahn.
DANFORTH: Puh-cahn.
STEWART: And she's 13. Then you have to look it up with her and, oh, God, it's so annoying.
MARTÍNEZ: It turns out there was even a higher authority on the pronunciation of this word than Martha Stewart. So what did you guys do next?
CHILLAG: We did some digging and the word puh-cahn has its origins, we learned, in the Algonkian linguistic family. Ojibwe is an Algonkian language.
DANFORTH: We enlisted the help of an Ojibwe linguist and professor, Dr. Michael Migizi Sullivan. This is, we would say, the final verdict - Dr. Sullivan pronouncing the word.
MICHAEL MIGIZI SULLIVAN: We say buh-gahn (ph).
DANFORTH: Buh-gahn.
SULLIVAN: In Ojibwe, we spell it with a B. Now, being that the Europeans call it a puh-cahn, I'd say, would be the closest in the colloquial English that matches an Indigenous pronunciation, buh-gahn - puh-cahn (laughter).
DANFORTH: So the - if you were forced to accept an anglicized version of the word, puh-cahn would be better than pee-can?
SULLIVAN: Yes. Very much so (laughter). Pee-can sounds really American to me.
CHILLAG: Yeah.
SULLIVAN: (Laughter) Buh-gahn is where we're going for.
DANFORTH: So there you have it, A. It's puh-cahn, or if you want to show off, you can say buh-gahn.
CHILLAG: You know, if this fight breaks out among the other many fights at a Thanksgiving table, this one, you can be the final authority. It is puh-cahn.
MARTÍNEZ: All right. That's the hosts of NPR's podcast, How To Do Everything. Mike Danforth and Ian Chillag, thank you, you two, for settling this long-simmering debate.
CHILLAG: Thanks.
DANFORTH: Happy Thanksgiving.
(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC) Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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